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While I'm sure the thread will turn snooty soon enough - it's not my intent to start it with this comment, but do Goose Island or Sierra Nevada really count as craft beers?
Goose Island was a craft brewery until AB/InBev bought them out, but IIRC they've left Goose Island's brewing standards alone meaning that the beers remain pretty good. I don't know if that will continue in the future, as a new head took over in January of this year.
Who has the worst?
Seems like most ballparks I visit now have a really terrific selection of beers.
Who has the worst?
it's perfectly possible for big breweries to make outstanding mass-produced beer.
Another problem is that the craft beer market as defined is only 6% of the total beer market. That's grown like threefold in the last decade or so, but it still is negligible vs AB Inbev and Miller Coors stranglehold on the overall market (especially with AB Inbev trying to buy Groupo Modelo).
Well, despite the classification changes -- I'd say that Goose Island and Sam Adams mass-produced flagships are still fine beers ('outstanding' might be going a bit far), and SN's cred/smaller batches aside, I think it's fair to say that SNPA ought to be counted as "mass produced", at least, it's certainly easy enough to find virtually anywhere and it's within shouting distance of outstanding, I think.
“I saw craft brewers who couldn’t make their beers, or couldn’t make the beers they wanted to. We felt like we needed to share,” says Koch, recalling his company’s beginnings as a microbrewery. The hops were raffled off in a lottery, with breweries allotted up to 528 pounds of hops apiece, in 88-pound batches. “We asked brewers not to request hops because they’d save money; buy them because you need them.” More than 350 microbreweries applied—nearly one-fourth of all microbreweries in the U.S. “I knew there would be demand, but I didn’t realize that level of need,” Koch says.
that AB can make that stuff taste the same with multiple breweries with multiple local water sources is freaking amazing.
Ok, then we're not actually disagreeing, I just read "mass produced" inaccurately. I was thinking more of Shock Top, Blue Moon, etc.
Is a "craft beer" what we used to call a "micro brew"
Rundown of beers available in 2012 at each MLB Park.
Sounds like Miami and Toronto would be among the worst with KC not too far behind. Cincy seems really underrated.
it's perfectly possible for big breweries to make outstanding mass-produced beer.
Sierra Nevada still gets included in these discussions because of their "street cred". Along with Sam Adam's, they kind of kicked off the whole craft brewing thing.
Almost every one of the big and medium German brewers would qualify.
You're right, I should have limited my aspersions to AB InBev, Molson-Coors, and SAB Miller. And InBev will ruin Spaten soon enough, ask fans of Becks and Bass Ale. It's why I'm terrified for Goose Island, which had some great beers and which is now under the thumb of those monsters.
Fritz Maytag and his Anchor Brewing Co. say hello.
I toured the Chicago GI brewery last summer -- while most of the more macros (Honkers, 312, etc) are still brewed elsewhere - they do a fair number of small, local batches and per the guys I talked to during the tour -- AB/IB stays out of their way (though, I suppose, what are they gonna say?).
Of course, Sam Adams produces a ton of different beers.
...with KC not too far behind.
#30: I'd have to do a blind taste test with them to see how I feel. I mean, I don't hate Blue Moon the way I do Bud/Coors/Miller where I'd actually prefer not to drink anything than drink them, but they're below just about everything else and that's probably in part due to it's provenance.
Goose island it now taking taps from Lagunitas at AT&T park. I like the IPA as its a good beer, nothing really like the standard West Coast IPAs, so it was nice to see.
I just don't get this. Bud is not good and all, but it has its place. For example it's a great drink after working outside in the hot sun. Pound one or two and after cooling off then you can drink something with flavor.
That's a shame. I much prefer Lagunitas to Goose (although I do enjoy Sophie). Lagunitas IPA is solid and some of their other stuff is very good (Hop Stoopid, Sumpin, Sumpin, Lagunitas Sucks). Maybe not great for Summer, but should be very nice for a cool SF Summer evening.
Yeah, I'm no fan of InBev or the other giants, but even soulless corporate marketeers prefer not to trash a brand if they can help it. I've seen an increasing trend of giant corporation permitting new acquisitions to continue doing the things that made them worth acquiring in the first place. Not because they're good people who care about customers or continuity or any of that crap, but simply because it's better for business.
Why would you do that though when there are other low ABV beers that are much better? Lagunitas makes a DayTime IPA with flavor and just 4.65% ABV. Bell's makes a Midwestern Pale Ale that is delicious with just 5.2%. If you can handle chugging a Budweiser at 5.0% why not have something with flavor instead?
Flynn, how is Ess Eff as a beer town now? Did Anchor inspire a lot of copy cats? Is there a good microbrew pub/sports bar in the city?
It has nothing to do with the ABV%, it's the heaviness of a flavorful beer, as well as the desire to savor one. $$ also comes into play - craft beers can really put the dent in your wallet if you start buying a lot of them. If I am looking for a quick refreshing 12 oz of liquid a Bud is high on the list.
I think I'd take Goose over Lagunitas -- I particularly like Matilda (their take on a strong Belgian PA). It's not Delirium Tremens (or frankly, anything from Huyghe, probably my favorite brewery worldwide), but it's a very good knock off
I will maintain forever and always that if you want a beer you can just down like water -- there is no better match than Busch Light.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but it would make more sense to enjoy a lighter beer that is refreshing and flavorful. Styles such as berliner weisse, kellerweis, California common, "session" ales are meant to be refreshing and flavorful.
There is a perception to craft beer is only about massive ABVs and IBUs, but it is pretty uncommon at this point for a craft brewery to not have at least one light, refreshing option. Partially this is dogfooding; brewers like to drink beer as they brew and you can'y drink strong beers all day.
Some styles of beer lend themselves well to mass production. This is why you see a ton of lagers, wheat beer, and to a lesser extent pale ales. Stouts, sours, strong IPAs and other styles often require rarer ingredients (massive amounts of specialty hops or grain) or expensive infrastructure (barrels and space to age them).
AB/InBev and the like sell based on low price and marketing. It is not impossible for them to brew good beer, but it isn't part of their business plan. Their consistency is impressive as a technical achievement, but the beer ranges from terrible to below average so what is the point? I also don't see the ability to get identical terrible McDonald's hamburgers on 6 continents as a great accomplishment so I am may be an outlier.
I DO enjoy Bud, that's my point. And until I can get a 6-pack of 16 oz bottles from a craft brewer for $5 I am going to stick with it as my before-during-after chores beer.
InBev's track record isn't great, but as I pointed out before, there are many German brewers producing an absolute shitload of beer, much of which is of outstanding quality.
And that's fine. I guess the rationale of it having a place because it is easy to drink doesn't resound for those who think it's swill. If the only redeeming quality is that it is easy to drink you should probably find another way to intake your alcohol.
For you though there seems to be other reasons and that is 100% okay. Hugs for everyone!
True, true, I feel the same way about something like Mountain Dew.
Interestingly, Kauffman helped me mature my beer tastes by exposing me to Fat Tire on tap 15 some odd years ago. Back then, craft beers were few and far between (at least at the local grocer) and New Belgium were just beginning their expansion East (it hadn't yet made it to St. Louis, I believe). Fat Tire was a bit of a revelation for someone who had never drank anything other than mass-produced American piss (i.e., your favorite American Lager from Coors, A/B or Miller).
They removed Fat Tire on tap about a year before I left and it doesn't seem like they have improved much. I still do enjoy some New Belgium, but Leiny's are pretty terrible as a whole (except for Summer Shandy when it is 90+ degrees out). Shame.
I would guess part of it is Boulevard is just so dominant as a craft beer in this market, its seen as "Kansas City's beer" and while I love Boulevard, it has come at the price of crowding out any other would-be craft beers in the area.
Matilda is solid (no DT by any means but still good) and as mentioned I am a huge fan of Sophie, but the rest of their selection falls way short.
I assume the naming rights came with some sort of monopoly that prohibits good beer from entering the building (though that doesn't explain the presence of Leinenkugel's).
Not Flynn, but SF is a great beer town. Other than Anchor
the lakefront brewery is all hype.
sprecher is a long-time Wisconsin brewery with a devoted following. they do not distribute beyond Milwaukee or if they do it's a rare place. you can order their sodas on-line. the root beer and ginger ale are tremendous.
new glarus makes many fine beers according to the aficionados but the belle cow (ha, ha) is spotted cow
I do not drink beer. but I follow such things being in Wisconsin. that and the mrs drinks beer so I have to stay up to speed on such things
if you are going to Milwaukee what you need to do, and I mean you 'need' to do this, is the sprecher beer tasting at the brewery.
(though that doesn't explain the presence of Leinenkugel's
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